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Should municipal elections have party politics?

kEiThZ

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We've just seen an election where a lot of incumbents who quite frankly have some tepid records got re-elected. We've got a weak mayor system where we elect a guy who has no natural caucuse at council.

All this is a recipe for more gridlock.

In my books, party politics creates better qualified candidates, more turnover, and a sort of parliamentary system at council where the mayor will have a natural caucus with the councillors elected from his/her own party.
 
Not necessarily convinced by the need of a party system, that a party system is the best fit with municipal politics or that it will solve our ills. Simple term limits might be sufficient, combined with measures that discourages nepotism (none of that intrafamily dynasties).

AoD
 
In my books, party politics creates better qualified candidates, more turnover,
You mean like the party politics that elected some of those NDP candidates in Quebec last federal election?

I see it as a problem of engagement, of how both voters and politicians might interact in their community outside of election periods. Most people entering a voting booth have little idea of who those they're electing are. They just make a blind stab at a familiar name, or fall back on cynical simple notions of gravy trains and cookie jars.

Early on I thought the changes in how we communicate, social media and all that, might make it easier for people to become engaged and fresh candidates to rise up, Neshi-style. But after seeing how Domise was a bit of a superstar on these forums, twitter, Torontoist etc but made little impression in the end, doing little to shake Ford and coming in third, or seeing how Soknacki failed to gain any traction, I've become disenchanted in that promise.
 
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No, keep things as non-partisan as possible. I know there will always be more liberal or conservative councillors, but don't bring party politics into it.
 
Toronto's city government has a larger budget and more voters than half the provinces in this country. Yet, we still elect its politicians like we're a hamlet.

Surely, if party politics works for smaller provincial governments, it would work for the sixth largest government in Canada.

It won't fix all the problems. But I do think the campaigns would become much more like a major provincial or federal campaign. And it would draw more interest and attention from voters.
 
@typezed. Under a system of party politics, candidates like Domise would have had a real shot based on the party brand.

With the present system, he's gotta face up to the Ford brand alone. Imagine, running against a guy who was councillor for that ward earlier and the current mayor. Domise never stood much of a chance. It was wishful thinking on the part of some that the ABF movement would go down to the ward where Ford was first elected.

You either need another local superstar or party politics and a sweep election.
 
Toronto's city government has a larger budget and more voters than half the provinces in this country. Yet, we still elect its politicians like we're a hamlet.

There are cities around the world (e.g. Melbourne) where the entire metropolitan area is governed like a series of hamlets. The system does not equate to success or failure.

Surely, if party politics works for smaller provincial governments, it would work for the sixth largest government in Canada.

It's not a question as to whether it "works" (because as a system of governance, it will), but whether it provides the benefits you foresee it to.

It won't fix all the problems. But I do think the campaigns would become much more like a major provincial or federal campaign. And it would draw more interest and attention from voters.

Vancouver has a party-based system and the turnout doesn't even hit 40%.

AoD
 
Not necessarily convinced by the need of a party system, that a party system is the best fit with municipal politics or that it will solve our ills. Simple term limits might be sufficient, combined with measures that discourages nepotism (none of that intrafamily dynasties).

AoD

I'm inclined to agree but I wonder how you do this without making it anti-democratic.

This country doesn't have term limits for any public office. And how do you craft rules against relatives running without infringing that relative's right to run for public office?

There's also practical reality. Can't see any councillor voting for term limits. And I can't see any MPP voting for the same. They know full well, once the concept takes hold, they're next.
 
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There's also practical reality. Can't see any councillor voting for term limits. And I can't see any MPP voting for the same. They know full well, once the concept takes hold, they're next.

Maybe they will support term limits as long as it doesn't apply to themselves. In other words, as long as it only applies for new politicians elected after term limits are implemented.
 
@typezed. Under a system of party politics, candidates like Domise would have had a real shot based on the party brand.
That ward voted overwhelmingly for Doug and for Rob. Results in ward 2 if we had one backwards populist right-wing personality cult led by Doug, one center-right establishment party led by Tory and a rump of the NDP led by Olivia: exactly the same.
 
And now that I think about it, if there were parties much of the downtown might have be retained by established 'NDP' candidates, while the northern corners stayed with the dimwitted Ford cheerleaders. Leaving fewer representatives for centrist Tory to pick up. Voila, Ford Nation years 5-8.
 
I honestly believe that priority should be given to reforming our electoral system. A reformation of how we elect politicians might be much more beneficial to a higher turnover than term limits and may even result in a bloc of representatives who agree on most issues setting up as a sort of neo-caucus given the real mandates a proper electoral system would give our representatives.

That might be a stretch, but I can honestly say that the single biggest problem with politics in this country is our electoral system.

I'm not entirely disinterested in the idea of party politics at the municipal level, but I would strongly urge that the electoral system be changed first so that we aren't left with the same sort of problems that plague party politics at other levels. Reform the electoral system, see how that works out and then tinker with the rest.
 
Party politics is no panacea, especially not for the quality of candidates. After all, they have municipal parties in Montreal, and that hardly prevented an ongoing explosive corruption scandal.

It is interesting that party politics in Vancouver has generally made the mayoralty a springboard to success in provincial politics, eg. both Mike Harcourt and Gordon Campbell went on to become premier. Interestingly, though, Harcourt ran as an independent.

It's also wrong to suggest that official party politics hasn't occurred in Toronto. Layton ran as an official NDP candidate for mayor against Rowlands in 1991. Certainly both Barbara Hall and David Miller were rather accurately described as unofficial NDP candidates.

Anyway, I don't think there's any point in party politics at the municipal level. The problems in the system at present would be alleviated by ranked ballots and stronger ethics/COI regulations to deal with the likes of Mammo (and Fords).
 
Every news outlet (TV and paper) had plenty of information on the Mayor candidates. We were able to make informed choices in this area.
For Councillor, it is impossible to expect the media to adequately cover all 44 wards with enough info for a voter to make an informed decision. It is also unfair to expect a voter to attend multiple local debates to determine the views of the Council candidates.

The leaves the options as being;

  1. Cut the number of Councillors to single digits, so that the media would have an actual chance to cover each of these Mega-wards.
  2. Allow, and encourage councillors to align with parties. The parties have their reputations to consider, so they will only endorse someone who will not shame their name - this ensures better candidates. Having parties also allows the party to have city wide policies that would get attention in the media and would allow voters to make a more informed decision.
 
party politics in Toronto probably makes sense, most politicians who run are registered members of parties anyway (Ford & Tory PC, Chow NDP). The problem is whether or not a town of 2,000 people where people regularly get acclaimed should have party politics.
 

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