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China could build high speed rail through Canada to the USA

newearthling

newearthling

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http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/0...gh-speed-train-through-canada-to-the-u-s-repo

China mulling construction of high-speed train through Canada to the U.S.: report
Daniel Politi, Slate | May 12, 2014 12:10 PM ET
It sure sounds far-fetched but a story in the Beijing Times claims China is considering building a high-speed train that would connect China’s northeast with the United States. The project would cross Siberia and the Bering Strait to Alaska, and then go across Canada into the United States, according to the English-language report published in the state-run China Daily. To cross the Bering Strait into Alaska, the railway would need a 200 kilometre underwater tunnel, which implies it would be around four times the length of the tunnel that crosses the English Channel, notes a very skeptical Washington Post article on the report.
Click to expand...
The first is a line that would run from London via Paris, Berlin, Warsaw, Kiev and Moscow, where it would split into two routes, one of which would run to China through Kazakhstan and the other through eastern Siberia. The second line would begin in the far-western Chinese city of Urumqi and then run through Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Iran and Turkey to Germany. The third would begin in the south-western city of Kunming and end in Singapore.
Click to expand...
 
One comment to the NP article:

TDotMassive Helmethair • 2 days ago

In another report today, estimates are that up to 80% of water sources in China are heavily polluted, and 50% is undrinkable to humans... yet, this is what they drink every day.

The Chinese government recently admitted to the existence of "cancer towns"... whole towns that have been contaminated to the point that cancer and death rates are insanely high due to water pollution...

I spent 3 months backpacking, taking trains and buses across China... I can tell you, there are mega projects everywhere, but also pollution the likes of which we cannot fathom...
 
newearthling said:
http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/0...gh-speed-train-through-canada-to-the-u-s-repo

China mulling construction of high-speed train through Canada to the U.S.: report
Daniel Politi, Slate | May 12, 2014 12:10 PM ET
Click to expand...

This idea isn't as crazy as it sounds. The underground tunnel that would be needed isn't massively larger than the English Channel. It's definitely possible to build this.

Of course there are many other things standing in the way of this.
1. Who will pay for this? Are the United States and Canada willing to pay money for the rail through their countries? I doubt that they are.
2. Even if China pays for 100% of the line, will the United States allow them to build in their country? Will Canada?
3. How will travel times compare to air travel? This thing will have to travel from a specific point mainland United States, north to Alaska and south to a specific location in China. Meanwhile, aircraft can travel direct from anywhere in North America to anywhere in China. I don't think this will be any faster than air travel. And even if this train is somehow faster than air travel, it will only be so for a small %age of people that live near stations along this route.
4. How much will people be wiling to pay for a ticket?

Honestly I think China would be smarter to build a link between them and Europe.
 
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^ in the opening post it tells us how much longer the tunnel is than the chunnel....4X

in the opening post it states that the first phase is a connection to Europe.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
This idea isn't as crazy as it sounds. The underground tunnel that would be needed isn't massively larger than the English Channel. It's definitely possible to build this.


3. How will travel times compare to air travel? This thing will have to travel from a specific point mainland United States, north to Alaska and south to a specific location in China. Meanwhile, aircraft can travel direct from anywhere in North America to anywhere in China. I don't think this will be any faster than air travel. And even if this train is somehow faster than air travel, it will only be so for a small %age of people that live near stations along this route.
Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean "direct"... Most people in China don't live in Shanghai or Beijing, and most people in Canada don't live in Vancouver to Toronto, so either fly or take the train, they need to connect at one of those big citie and we know a flight connection takes hours while a train connection may take as little as 20 minutes. Someone from Manitoba will need to go through Vancouver to fly to anywhere in China.

Additionally, while the train goes through Alaska, a plane flies over the north pole as well (for example Beijing to Toronto flight). It is not that different.
 
TOareaFan said:
^ in the opening post it tells us how much longer the tunnel is than the chunnel....4X
Click to expand...

"Chunnel" lol

4x longer isn't "massively larger". If we could find a way to build Chunnel I'm sure an Alaska-Russia tunnel is possible.

in the opening post it states that the first phase is a connection to Europe.
Click to expand...

My bad. Well this thing probably won't be getting past phase 1. ;)
 
ksun said:
Not sure what you mean "direct"... Most people in China don't live in Shanghai or Beijing, and most people in Canada don't live in Vancouver to Toronto, so either fly or take the train, they need to connect at one of those big cities. Someone from Manitoba will need to go through Vancouver to fly to anywhere in China.

Additionally, while the train goes through Alaska, a plane flies over the north pole as well (for example Beijing to Toronto flight). It is not that different.
Click to expand...

I didn't know that. I suppose the plane could be competitive. However I think that it would still be slower because of the stops it would need to make along the route. And are there any trains than can match the speeds of a commercial jetliner?
 
TOareaFan said:
^ in the opening post it tells us how much longer the tunnel is than the chunnel....4X

in the opening post it states that the first phase is a connection to Europe.
Click to expand...

Chunnel was built 20 years ago.
For China to do something 4x larger today is not surpring by any stretch.

China seems to be constructing a railway all the way to Singapore through Laos and Thailand
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...3/Chinas-120mph-railway-arriving-in-Laos.html

Notice the date : "Constructing it will be a mammoth engineering task. It will require 154 bridges and 76 tunnels, as well as 31 train stations, just to get the line the 260 miles from Boten on the Laos-China border to Laos’ capital VientianeAn estimated 20,000 Chinese workers will be needed to build it, with the completion date set for 2019". -- this is sooner than the completion of our 19km Eglinton line , LOL
 
TheTigerMaster said:
"Chunnel" lol
Click to expand...

Didn't make that up.....showing my age, I guess, that is what it was commonly called during the planning and construction....not sure if that name survived in common use.



TheTigerMaster said:
4x longer isn't "massively larger". If we could find a way to build Chunnel I'm sure an Alaska-Russia tunnel is possible.
Click to expand...

If the chunnel were 10km then I might agree that 40km is not massively larger.....but I am not sure that 50 - 200 is of the same order of scalability.
 
TOareaFan said:
If the chunnel were 10km then I might agree that 40km is not massively larger.....but I am not sure that 50 - 200 is of the same order of scalability.
Click to expand...

Chunnel is only the world's 10th longest tunnel. And among the top 10, 3 are in China.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_tunnels_in_the_world

Only 2 months ago, China unveils a plan to build the 77 mile tunnel between two coastal cities, and to be the world's longest
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-77-mile-22billion-tunnel-longest-world.html

It is China we are talking about. They get things done and done fast. It is not Toronto where the non-challenging 200 meter island airport tunnel is take 3 years. It takes less time for China to build a 20km subway.
 
The Russian government is interested in that as well. They also want to construct a high speed rail line linking Moscow with Fukuoka (in Japan), via tunnels between the Russian mainland and Sakhalin and between Sakhalin and Hokkaido, which would then connect with the existing rail lines in Japan.

I bet that the line from Beijing to Vancouver would be jointly owned by the Chinese and Russian governments.

Both China and Russia are good friends these days.
 
ksun said:
Chunnel is only the world's 10th longest tunnel. And among the top 10, 3 are in China.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_tunnels_in_the_world

Only 2 months ago, China unveils a plan to build the 77 mile tunnel between two coastal cities, and to be the world's longest
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-77-mile-22billion-tunnel-longest-world.html

It is China we are talking about. They get things done and done fast. It is not Toronto where the non-challenging 200 meter island airport tunnel is take 3 years. It takes less time for China to build a 20km subway.
Click to expand...

Must be nice to not have to answer to taxpayers/voters about how their money is spent. I can see, now, why Justin Trudeau admires them so much ;)

On your last point about getting things done...from the article you linked in Daily Mail:

The first proposal for the undersea link was made in 1994 but it has been stuck in the planning stages ever since.
Click to expand...

perhaps the differences are not so clear after all?
 
I saw a documentary a while ago about the possibility of building a bridge over the Bearing Strait. Perhaps such a bridge could incorporate both a highway and high speed trains below.

[video=youtube;-YK_i0b-l_8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YK_i0b-l_8[/video]
 
^ 3 years for the island tunnel is for construction only.

200 meters of tunnel taking 3 years is really slow... let's not deny that. Shanghai's Dalian road tunnel, which is 2.5 KM, took 2 years and 4 months.

Shanghai's subway line 12 (phase one), which is 19km (same as Eglinton Crosstown), took 3.5 years (July 2010-Dec 2013).

We all know China is different in many respects, but what we do here is really really slow for many unjustifiable reasons.
 
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