Daimler Closing Orion Bus Plant in Mississauga

[drum118]

I guess TTC will be buying either NFI or Nova now starting with the first order this year.

No surprise since no one wants to buy their buses these day as well with all the
problems TTC had with the Orion Hybrid buses.

The last few months of 2011, saw no buses in the yard or across the street at all.

Only a dozen Cutaways in the yard at Christmas with shells for more across. This
told me then Orion was done.

We only have Nova and NFI now for buses. Not sure if Eldorado will try to get their 40's up here or they have been approved to do so, other than the 30's.

Maybe NABI will now try get their buses approved as well Gillig. Gillg buses are not that bad from the ones I have seen.

Based on my first ride on a Nova artic last month, lack power on the hill
regardless if full or empty. There are worse than the old MT 9700's artic's for power.

Since TTC is ordering artic's this year, would not surprised if we see Nova as the
winner. 60% Canadian made vs. 25% NFI.

Never like the Orion VII from day one until I rode MT and OC new ones in 2010 that were
better than any of TTC ones.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/daimler-closing-mississauga-ont-bu\
s-plant/article2413516/

[ShonTron]

Sad news for the manufacturing sector.

Brampton's the guinea pig for the new NFI Xcelsior artics as they begin to arrive and going into service in the fall. Perhaps the TTC will be getting them from NFI as well?

Will the TTC or other municipal or provincial transit operators purchase buses with minimal or no Canadian content (Viva's first order aside), or will Nova and NFI pick up the slack? GO Transit's buses are made by MCI, which has operations in Manitoba. Nova re-entered the American market after an absence. Would we see NABI or Gillig open up a Canadian plant or source from Canadian suppliers to break into our smaller, but stronger transit market?

[Electrify]

I guess they won't be updating their website after all...

http://www.orionbus.com/

(FYI: This has been the front page of their website since last fall, they've just changed the proposed date for the new website every time they miss a deadline)

They blame the slowing market for this move, but I really think it has more to do with offering a sub-par product lineup. Besides the poor webpage presentation, the look of the Orion VII looks like a poor imitation of New Flyer's product. They didn't offer any articulated buses (though there were constant rumours they were to debut one in the near future), and they did a poor job pushing and promoting their BRT product line - which wasn't even featured on its website. Add to this the questionable reliability of their hybrid vehicles, and it became clear why cities chose competitors over their buses.

This is just another drop in the bucket for Daimler's reputation, which is known for poor quality automotive products (Chrysler, Dodge). Seeing how many people are now out of work, I hope our governments think twice before offering them a bailout next time they are in financial trouble.

I suppose it is sad to see this company which has Ontario to thank for its roots go, but as pointed out above, they have been on life support for far too long. As a shareholder of New Flyer though, I'm hoping for a nice boost in value in the short term now that their prime competitor is no more

[unimaginative2]

This is just another drop in the bucket for Daimler's reputation, which is known for poor quality automotive products (Chrysler, Dodge). Seeing how many people are now out of work, I hope our governments think twice before offering them a bailout next time they are in financial trouble.

Daimler hasn't owned Chrysler for a number of years and they didn't receive any bailout money.

This is definitely sad news. I'm amazed by how many bus manufacturers Canada has. Hopefully they can pick up the slack and make a quality product. This may be reputation from years ago, but I always thought Gilligs were supposed to be terrible.

[mpd618]

I'm reminded of how Preston Car & Coach (way back in the day) was bought up by the American company Brill, which then closed it down a couple of years later. Less competition and consolidating manufacturing in other countries isn't a good thing.

[ShonTron]

Reminded of Preston Car and Coach? Wow, that was back in the day! How about Russell Motors on Weston Road being bought by Willys-Overland? Nothing left of that.
For a more modern example, there's always Caterpillar/Electromotive.

As I understand, Gilligs are the bottom of the barrel (still) when seeking a bus that falls under Buy America.

Neoplan USA (a very loose relation with the German Neoplan) suffered from a similar fate and similar circumstances as Orion, a one-time competitor for transit buses:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoplan_USA

[mpd618]

Reminded of Preston Car and Coach? Wow, that was back in the day! How about Russell Motors on Weston Road being bought by Willys-Overland? Nothing left of that.
For a more modern example, there's always Caterpillar/Electromotive.

Yeah, it's just the local example (I'm in Waterloo).

[drum118]

Sad news for the manufacturing sector.

Brampton's the guinea pig for the new NFI Xcelsior artics as they begin to arrive and going into service in the fall. Perhaps the TTC will be getting them from NFI as well?

Will the TTC or other municipal or provincial transit operators purchase buses with minimal or no Canadian content (Viva's first order aside), or will Nova and NFI pick up the slack? GO Transit's buses are made by MCI, which has operations in Manitoba. Nova re-entered the American market after an absence. Would we see NABI or Gillig open up a Canadian plant or source from Canadian suppliers to break into our smaller, but stronger transit market?

TTC has mandated that all equipment be 25% plus Canadian Content. Ontario has the same mandate as well now.

Since Nova has the highest content at 60%, they will have a leg up on NFI.

As for other companies entering the Canadian market from the US, I see it not happening at this time. NABI has been around a long time and have never really try entering the market up here from what I know of at this time due to duel cost and overhead.

Since TTC is now moving to LRT, their bus requirements will fall as these lines come on line and will shrink their market requirements. Going to artic's, it will shrink the 40' bus requirement more.

Since VIVA is moving to all artic's, more 40' shrinking.

NABI, Nova and NFI are the only supplier of artic's as VanHool only builds for a small number of buses yearly.