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Thread: Increase Ontario 400-series Highway Speed Limit

  1. Default Increase Ontario 400-series Highway Speed Limit

    We are gathering public support for legalizing 120 km/h on Ontario’s highways. Speeds of 120-130 are currently the norm. We want to give both the drivers and the police clearer rules to abide by instead of widespread violations as it's currently the case.

    If you would like to READ MORE and SUPPORT the cause, LIKE our facebook page at www.facebook.com/stop100

    Also, please take a speed limit poll to find out the general opinion on the topic at the bottom of www.stop100.ca

    We need as many votes as possible. Even if you are against the idea, we want your negative vote!

    Also, please read some FAQs about the topic on www.stop100.ca/faq.html


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    Have your say at: www.stop100.ca/choose.html

  3. #3

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    I think there are definitely places where it should be much higher, but also places where it could even be lowered. For example, there are places along the 401 collector lanes where it could be lowered to 90-80km/h as there is a lot of merging with little length to do so safely. A great example of this is westbound, just beyond the 400 where you have heavy amounts of traffic from the 400 trying to merge left and traffic trying to get off at Weston Rd trying to merge right - all in under 800m of road space!

    Outside of urban areas, you could probably increase it with little problems. At the very least, maybe between April-October increase the speed limit since in winter months you need to use extra caution (ya, obviously people should drive according to the road conditions regardless. But people are also stupid and can't drive very well).

    Also, if there is ANY highway which needs its speed increased, it is the 407! The damn thing is designed like the Autobahn or a race track, having the speed limit at 100km/h is a giant tease!

  4. #4

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    I'd say raise the speed limit in the Express lanes to 120 and keep 100 in the collector.

  5. #5

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    Also want to add that even with an increased speed limit, I still think people will go 10-20km/h+ over the limit. This isn't because people are stupid and can't drive (well, maybe a little...), but because the design of many of our highways feel as if they could handle no speed limit.

    For example, the 400 is virtually a straightaway between the 401 and Highway 9, a distance of about 35km. If the speed limit was 120km/h, even if just beyond where the urban area ends at Teston, I would most definitely take advantage of the "20km/h grace period" and drive about 140km/h. I'm certain many would go even faster, and would still be relatively safe.

    But yes, in places where the speed limit does feel like the maximum, it is rare to see people go much faster than it. Keele between Finch and Grandravine* the speed limit is 60km/h, and with the narrowness of the road and lanes, and all the heavy car and truck traffic, it is difficult to go even that speed and still feel safe.

    *This is when I used to drive this stretch regularly a few years back. With the subway construction, I don't know what it is like through this area right now.
    Last edited by Electrify; 2012-Mar-02 at 19:21.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Toronto, Montreal
    Posts
    684

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    I'm not sure I'm for increasing speed limits since the majority of drivers exceed the posted limit anyway. Raising the limit will only encourage drivers to drive at even higher speeds. Now I do agree that certain stretches, for example, 401 express westbound just after ther 427 near YYZ is like a wide-open speedway. It'd be pretty difficult to do 100 kph there unless there's a huge backup in traffic.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Mississauga, where cars rule city growth
    Posts
    7,688

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I'm not sure I'm for increasing speed limits since the majority of drivers exceed the posted limit anyway. Raising the limit will only encourage drivers to drive at even higher speeds. Now I do agree that certain stretches, for example, 401 express westbound just after ther 427 near YYZ is like a wide-open speedway. It'd be pretty difficult to do 100 kph there unless there's a huge backup in traffic.
    Go to Texas and some western state where 75mph is used with a fair number of states having 65mph.

    110 should be the limit within Toronto and 130 outside. This includes other cities and towns that the 400 series highway run through just like in the US.

    Raising the speed limit will slow some hot foot driver down.

    My last trip to London at Christmas, I was doing 120 and getting pass left and right. I was even on the tail of an OPP doing 120 that was unmarked and he was pass a number of times before getting off. Never went after those drivers, since there was little traffic on the road at the time.
    Due Time restriction, visit my site https://www.flickr.com/photos/drum118/ to see updated photos of projects shot the last few weeks since I don't have the time to post them to various threads.
    See my videos on YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/Transitdrum118/videos

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Electrify View Post
    I think there are definitely places where it should be much higher, but also places where it could even be lowered. For example, there are places along the 401 collector lanes where it could be lowered to 90-80km/h as there is a lot of merging with little length to do so safely. A great example of this is westbound, just beyond the 400 where you have heavy amounts of traffic from the 400 trying to merge left and traffic trying to get off at Weston Rd trying to merge right - all in under 800m of road space!

    Outside of urban areas, you could probably increase it with little problems. At the very least, maybe between April-October increase the speed limit since in winter months you need to use extra caution (ya, obviously people should drive according to the road conditions regardless. But people are also stupid and can't drive very well).

    Also, if there is ANY highway which needs its speed increased, it is the 407! The damn thing is designed like the Autobahn or a race track, having the speed limit at 100km/h is a giant tease!
    The big delema about speed limits is that the locations where it is the safest to go 120 or even 140, that is where it is easiest for police to set up speed traps. I am talking about the rural areas: QEW on the south side of the lake, highway 400 north of Major Mac, highway 401 outside of Toronto.

    The busy and more complicated merging areas are where the speed should be enforced, but it is difficult to place police cars there - i.e. much of Toronto.

    I would vote for a 120km/h speed limit outside of the GTA. If you are only going 5 or 10 km (i.e. within Toronto), the extra speed will not change your travel time. If you are going to Niagara Falls, London, Ottawa, or Montreal, that is were you can safely go 120, and there is a real benefit to going that fast as well.

    I do not expect any government to act on this. Even if the number of accidents goes down, the first fatality at the higher speed limit will be linked to the government that raised the speed.

    It is interesting that on other threads people say that transit should be planned by engineers and planners, but nobody seems to want engineers to determine the speed limits - even though they are the ones who design the roads and know what the safe speed should be.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Former City of York, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3,804

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    It should be 175km/h

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Yonge & Mt.Pleasant
    Posts
    3,787

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    People know there are no demerit points below 15km/h over the speed limit, so people drive around 15km/h over the limit. Raising the speed limit to 120km/h means many will drive 135km/h. It will only increase the number of accidents because while some drivers are good enough to go 120km/h, keep in their lane, and adjust speed to traffic and road conditions even when that means going below the limit, there are crappy drivers as well which blaze by slow moving traffic leaving them with no time to react to a lane change, people who set their cruise control to 120km/h in a blizzard, etc. Really there are times when it is perfectly safe to drive 150km/h on the freeway, but the problem is that there are conditions where that is not the case and many drivers lack good judgment. What I think they should do is have more signs that display the speed limit, and allow MTO to set the speeds based on road conditions. Maybe some days it would be 120km/h, maybe over the long weekend it would be 80km/h.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Best Toronto
    Posts
    4,467

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    I was travelling to Ottawa a few months ago and everyone (including myself) were safely travelling between 120 and 140 kmph once we got outside of the GTA. I saw several police officers who didn't even care. The law definitely needs to be changed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheTigerMaster View Post
    I was travelling to Ottawa a few months ago and everyone (including myself) were safely travelling between 120 and 140 kmph once we got outside of the GTA. I saw several police officers who didn't even care. The law definitely needs to be changed.
    Especially when you get on the 416. That stretch between the 401 and 417 is boring!

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    Thanks for all the comments, guys.

    Our plan is to not just talk about the initiative but actually push it much, much further. The poll results (about 200 votes so far) show about 85% approval rate so we simply do not believe the will of the people can be ignored any longer (by keeping the lowest speed limit on the planet and remaining in a silly, hypocritical situation where the cops basically decide the law and the roads are super safe but the officials do not acknowledge much higher average speeds - speeds that are nowhere close to 100km/h).

    Here is what we need from those who enthusiastically support our cause:

    1. Read and help us improve the case on www.stop100.ca. Make sure you LIKE it if you use facebook to keep the number growing.

    2. Help us spread the word about www.stop100.ca to other forums/places where people can sign up and take our poll - we want to reach as many people as possible to have a true measure of public opinion when this goes to Queens Park. (Feel free to PM us with forum suggestions where Ontarians participate)

    3. Any other advice you can provide (if anyone asks "why facebook" - show us an alternative)

    The plan is to take this to the media soon and get much higher numbers. Then to the politicians. We want to be able to show them that a VAST majority supports it and wants freedom from speed limit hypocrisy (yes, that hypocrisy which shows that cops are clearly on our side by allowing 120 km/h often all the way to 130 because they agree that it's safe to practice such speeds or even hair bit faster - as per my observations and some of yours that you've described).

    We welcome any advice and helping to spread the word. Let the people have their will!

    If you would like to READ MORE and SUPPORT the cause, LIKE our facebook page at www.facebook.com/stop100

    Have your voice and vote at www.stop100.ca/choose.html

    Also, please read some FAQs about the topic on www.stop100.ca/faq.html

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    The fact that everyone drives 20 over is what's wrong with the system. If they want to maintain that, at least raise the speed limit to 110 and bring it in line with the rest of Canada. What point are rules and laws if they aren't going to enforced? Personally, I'd like to see 120 as the speed limit with photo radar brought back.

    But I don't see this happening with Premier Dad. While I like some of McGuinty's policies, he's the most anti-libertarian leader in a while. The king of nanny-state laws. And you expect him to change the speed limit? The insurance companies will make a big deal of the issue and it'll be dead-on-arrival. I'd be more worried about McGuinty lowering speed limits (especially off expressways) if anything.

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    If need be, we will keep this going until the new election.... And make sure they hear about this every day. If the number of supporters continue to be at 85% or so, they'll have a hard time ignoring the issue. Thanks for your feedback.

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