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Toronto Can Support more NHL teams

I hate when this topic comes up people talk about Hamilton or Kitchener.... Or some other 905 destination..... I prefer the idea of Downsview much more... The 905 could still drive in... But Toronto businesses could support it... And Torontonians who are priced out of the Leafs can get a ticket.... We should be looking more similar to the lakers/clippers same stadium situation or the mets/yankees close enough to the city situation... then trying to build a suburban team... How has that worked out? New Jersey Nets? Miami Heat (BTW CANT SELL OUT)? Glendale Coyotes? Ottawa Senators (where are the suits in the crowd.. theyre arent any... ottawa businesses dont support them since theyre too far)
 
Simple enough, Toronto doesn't have a second team because the Leafs (and the NHL) don't want one here. George Gillett (after he sold the Habs) has openly pondered the thought of a second Montreal team, and if he thinks a second Montreal team would be successful, then there is no doubt about the success of a Toronto team.

Strangely, people seem to think that North American cities can't support multiple teams when most big European cities have multiple soccer clubs. When a sport is a cultural phenomenon, people will support it. The only issue beyond that is corporate support, and clearly the GTA has plenty of that behind it.

Oh and sixrings, there's no way another team would move into the ACC. With the Leafs, Raptors, Rock and various concerts (which are a huge money maker) it would be impossible to fit another team in there just from a logistical standpoint, nevermind taking into account the financial reasons why it wouldn't work for a 2nd hockey team.
 
Oh and sixrings, there's no way another team would move into the ACC. With the Leafs, Raptors, Rock and various concerts (which are a huge money maker) it would be impossible to fit another team in there just from a logistical standpoint, nevermind taking into account the financial reasons why it wouldn't work for a 2nd hockey team.

I dont think the ACC is going to happen but a team close to the 401 could and maybe should happen.... (BUT I dont buy the ROCK using the ACC as an excuse) The reason why we wont get a seconed team and why it wont be in ACC is because LEAF nation is somewhat scared that their CRAP product could result in lose of fan base to a new franchise that might actually win more.. IN all the markets where there are two teams the NUMBER 1 TEam is always a GOOD team while the second team almost always sucks.... YANKEES #1 Mets cant win National LEague... LAKERS #1 Clippers just won the draft lottery RANGERS #1 Islanders in a pathetic stadium and New Jersey well they are in NEW JERSEY.... The one rare exception was the recent success of the JETS but then again the GIANTS had just won..
 
I never suggested the Rock were a reason, but they are a tenant.

I also don't buy that MLSE (or whoever ends up buying them) is fearful of becoming the "bad team" in a "good team/bad team" scenario. There are countless examples where teams coexist without any sort of hierarchy. The Devils and Islanders have been far more successful than the Rangers, though the Rangers have had their own success. Neither the Cubs or White Sox are perennial successes (in fact both have been horrible for nearly 100 years). The Dodgers and Angels have each been successful. In soccer there are even more examples. There's no catch-all rule. Both teams can be competitive and crappy. There's no rhyme or reason to it, and team success is often cyclical anyways.

There's this huge myth that MLSE doesn't want to win and they only care about money, but the fact is that this idea couldn't be farther from the truth. They understand that winning and money can go hand in hand because one playoff game is equal to 2million dollars in revenue. They've never purposely put out a bad product just to rip people off. In fact, most recently they've went out and hired the two biggest names in their respective sports to help run their basketball and hockey teams. You have to also remember that this is a salary cap system where you only have a limited ability to really control your team's success.

The fact is, the reason the Leafs don't want a team in their area is because they don't want to share a piece of the regional pie in the same way if you own a store you wouldn't want a similar store opening up next door. Even if the Leafs were winning Stanley Cups every year, and they knew that they were the dominant team in the region, they still wouldn't want another team in their backyard. It's just business.
 
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I never suggested thaqt the leafs dont want to win.. But they have been unable to win... SInce 67 specifically... The leafs know that they maintain their fan base because of their excellent marketing, the leaf mystic, the fact they have a monopoly, elitism (ppl like saying they sat in the platinums at ACC) and their history... If another team managed to move in and actually win the Leafs marketing could only do so much to keep the fan base... How long ago was 67?
 
I never suggested thaqt the leafs dont want to win.. But they have been unable to win... SInce 67 specifically... The leafs know that they maintain their fan base because of their excellent marketing, the leaf mystic, the fact they have a monopoly, elitism (ppl like saying they sat in the platinums at ACC) and their history... If another team managed to move in and actually win the Leafs marketing could only do so much to keep the fan base... How long ago was 67?
Just because they haven't won the Stanley Cup since 67 that doesn't mean they've had bad teams. They had highly competitive teams through most of the 70s, 90s, and early 2000s. And they finally have the building blocks of a good team again, both on the team and in the minors.
 
And Torontonians who are priced out of the Leafs can get a ticket....

Every time this topic comes up I end up having to ask this question and it never gets answered...but here goes.....

.....do people really think that a rich guy/corporation are gonna pay for an expansion or relocation ($200mil?)......pay a territorial fee to MLSE ($200 mil?)......and build an NHL rink($300 mil?)......

......just so they can charge lower admission prices? I don' think the goal of a second NHL team is to lower ticket prices.
 
Every time this topic comes up I end up having to ask this question and it never gets answered...but here goes.....

.....do people really think that a rich guy/corporation are gonna pay for an expansion or relocation ($200mil?)......pay a territorial fee to MLSE ($200 mil?)......and build an NHL rink($300 mil?)......

......just so they can charge lower admission prices? I don' think the goal of a second NHL team is to lower ticket prices.

EVery major city with two teams and one team dominates... The second team charges less for tickets... But its not just the ticket prices which are the problem for Torontonians.... its the fact that we cant even get tickets... Maple leaf tickets are owned by people who have had season tickets for the last 20 years... If you arent one of the lucky few you are screwed. I know someone who was forced to buy pltinum level raptor season seats just to get on the fast list to be able to buy platinum level leaf season tickets.. Think about that if he owns two tickets to every raptor game at 300 each.... thats 600 x 42 = 25200 just for the oppertunity to buy a seats to the leaf games... plus how much are his leaf tickets???????
 
EVery major city with two teams and one team dominates... The second team charges less for tickets... But its not just the ticket prices which are the problem for Torontonians.... its the fact that we cant even get tickets... Maple leaf tickets are owned by people who have had season tickets for the last 20 years... If you arent one of the lucky few you are screwed. I know someone who was forced to buy pltinum level raptor season seats just to get on the fast list to be able to buy platinum level leaf season tickets.. Think about that if he owns two tickets to every raptor game at 300 each.... thats 600 x 42 = 25200 just for the oppertunity to buy a seats to the leaf games... plus how much are his leaf tickets???????

Few points in rebuttal


1.....Most (all?) of those multiple team situations date way back and do not involve a situation where the upfront cost of the team is around $600 million. Deal with that reality...a second Toronto team will have to generate revenue sufficient to warrant/justify a $600 million investment....that does not scream out "low ticket prices" to me.

2....The kind of owner that is gonna write that kind of cheque is not doing so to be a dominated second class team.

3....You have just described a market where you can see examples (and I know they exist as well) of people paying $25k a year for sports tickets they are just marginally interested in so that they have a spot in line if the tickets they really want come along.......and yet you still think the second team is about (or will lead to) lower prices?
 

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