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Election Results- Moving Forward

New_EastYork

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Unfortunately, Transit City which had passed through the many motions of Environmental Assessment, Planning, and even funding have been effectively cancelled with tonights election results. Subways are what the people want, and that must be acknowledged. But here are my views about the Pro's of this and then some concerns I have (NOT a reflection of my vote or political leaning, strictly about transit)

Extending the Sheppard Line as a subway makes the most sense in terms of network connectivity. to take the subway to Don Mills, then wait for a street level LRT that travels at half the speed to complete the originally intended alignment was never an acceptable idea.

For anyone who has taken the SRT in Scarborough i'm sure you can relate to the feeling this retro technology (although really cool sounding) "just doesn't feel right".

In terms of both proposed subway extensions, I hope above ground options are explored, tunnels are so expensive for reasons I don't understand.

But West End residents were completely left out in this transit plan, which wasn't very comprehensive. So many of you (my friends) are west enders and I know traffic can be really heavy at times. With that, further advocacy of the Downtown Relief Line ending at Dundas West station could be a great start. I get the feeling BRT lines will work out well in North Etobicoke.

As for this war on streetcars, we will fight to keep a moderate level of lines. At least five need to stay, and those will certainly be advocated for. Its not quite the nightmare that first comes to mind.
 
Unfortunately, Transit City which had passed through the many motions of Environmental Assessment, Planning, and even funding have been effectively cancelled with tonights election results. Subways are what the people want, and that must be acknowledged. But here are my views about the Pro's of this and then some concerns I have (NOT a reflection of my vote or political leaning, strictly about transit)

Extending the Sheppard Line as a subway makes the most sense in terms of network connectivity. to take the subway to Don Mills, then wait for a street level LRT that travels at half the speed to complete the originally intended alignment was never an acceptable idea.

For anyone who has taken the SRT in Scarborough i'm sure you can relate to the feeling this retro technology (although really cool sounding) "just doesn't feel right".

In terms of both proposed subway extensions, I hope above ground options are explored, tunnels are so expensive for reasons I don't understand.

But West End residents were completely left out in this transit plan, which wasn't very comprehensive. So many of you (my friends) are west enders and I know traffic can be really heavy at times. With that, further advocacy of the Downtown Relief Line ending at Dundas West station could be a great start. I get the feeling BRT lines will work out well in North Etobicoke.

As for this war on streetcars, we will fight to keep a moderate level of lines. At least five need to stay, and those will certainly be advocated for. Its not quite the nightmare that first comes to mind.

SIgh... No, no no.. Rob Ford has admitted that if he couldn't redirect funds or sell off the streetcars, he'd stick with the current (TC & new streetcar) plans. And that is pretty much what will happen. He's indifferent to the transit (except for when it gets in the way of cars) so, to him, this is a non-issue.. if its funded and he can't do anything different with the funds, he'll let it continue.

Eglinton and Sheppard will continue as planned. Metrolinx and Province are carrying through with this one...

The dreams of these becoming subways are just that.. dreams.. otherwise, Ford would be losing tax payer's money in the millions.. and then spending MORE to try and send things back to the drawing board EA stage adding years/decades to the new plans.

So, the same deal still applies.. get these lines that are funded done? or nothing. Thats not to say the other unfunded TC lines aren't dead... most likely they won't see the light of day with no one pushing for them. (Unless metrolin keeps on it)
 
SIgh... No, no no.. Rob Ford has admitted that if he couldn't redirect funds or sell off the streetcars, he'd stick with the current (TC & new streetcar) plans.

As mayor of Toronto, why do you think he could not direct funds? Transit City was Miller's baby. And Metrolinx takes its cue from the municipalities. It's "plan", if you can even call it that, is endlessly malleable.

Also, I'd like a quotation where Ford says he's changed his mind about streetcars and loves them now.
 
Are people suggesting that Rob Ford had a transit plan that, knowing Transit City was costly to cancel, was created to lead people on? Was Ford acting like a politician saying one thing over here and another conflicting statement over there? Say it ain't so. A councillor with all the budget items at his finger tips leading us on. Luring votes with grandiose subway plans he knew couldn't be built because he drew the lines on the specific places LRT was already being built.
 
As mayor of Toronto, why do you think he could not direct funds? Transit City was Miller's baby. And Metrolinx takes its cue from the municipalities. It's "plan", if you can even call it that, is endlessly malleable.

Also, I'd like a quotation where Ford says he's changed his mind about streetcars and loves them now.

He could not redirect funds because they are not his funds to 're'direct and the province has stated this several times. They say the plan is in place and they are sticking to it.

Rob Ford was quoted in both the Sun and Star about "shrugging his shoulders and saying he'd stick to the current plan" in follow up interviews. This was discussed in other threads as well, weeks ago. He doesn't love street cars, he's about as indifferent to them and transit, as he always has been... meaning, they're not even on his mind much.
 
I can't think for a minute that Metrolinx would direct funds in direction Ford wants.

We have a Liberal provincial government. If they want re-election, part of this is to make Ford look as bad as possible.

At the same time they are looking for excuses to save money.

I'd expect they would simply cancel existing projects if city doesn't support; and fund nothing new.

The window has passed; I suspect the only new transit we'lll see other than GO before 2030 is the Spadina extension, and whatever they do with the SRT ... likely simply Mark II vehicles now, as that is cheapest option
 
I can't think for a minute that Metrolinx would direct funds in direction Ford wants.

We have a Liberal provincial government. If they want re-election, part of this is to make Ford look as bad as possible.

At the same time they are looking for excuses to save money.

I'd expect they would simply cancel existing projects if city doesn't support; and fund nothing new.

And in doing so, we'd have wasted upwards of $700 million on TC up until that moment... Not even Ford would want that.. Ford supporters? Would he?
 
They interviewed the chair of metrolinx on CP24.

He very cautiously said " we'll talk with the new mayor" - but that we have a plan, Move Ontario , that is already being built.

Very polite way of telling Ford to stick it, more or less.

Considering Ford didn't run on a transit platform, he doesn't really want to fight the battle and neither does the province, I doubt anybody will pursue it further.
 
And in doing so, we'd have wasted upwards of $700 million on TC up until that moment... Not even Ford would want that.. Ford supporters? Would he?
Most of this is for TBMs, LRT vehicles, and Agincourt grade separation. Grade separation can still be used for GO. LRT vehicles can be transferred to Kitchener or Ottawa. I'm sure someone would want TBMS ... and contract is recent ... can probably cancel for small $$$.
 
Most of this is for TBMs, LRT vehicles, and Agincourt grade separation. Grade separation can still be used for GO. LRT vehicles can be transferred to Kitchener or Ottawa. I'm sure someone would want TBMS ... and contract is recent ... can probably cancel for small $$$.

Not according to the city's website.. but its strongly worded strictly for the purposes to scare off any cancellations. And as been stated by both Metrolinx and the Province; they already have a plan, and they are sticking to it.
 
Most of this is for TBMs, LRT vehicles, and Agincourt grade separation. Grade separation can still be used for GO. LRT vehicles can be transferred to Kitchener or Ottawa. I'm sure someone would want TBMS ... and contract is recent ... can probably cancel for small $$$.

Exclusive of those. 1.44 billion if you include those. 620 mil in design and consulting alone has been spent. That is 12x the TBM cost.
 
TransitCity was an example of why Smitherman and Pantelone got kicked in the ass tonight. Whether you liked TC or not your opinion was irrelevant. I don't recall anyone in Toronto demanding streetcars all over the place, especially after St.Clair. Unfortunately that didn't matter. Miller and the TTC made a decision and there were to be no questions asked. The "open houses" were not designed for feedback but rather the TTC telling you what they are doing.
It was this decree by the almighty City Hall that exemplifies why Torontonians wanted a completely new start.
Whether for good or ill the public wants subways and even if that means less areas covered then so be it. I think Ford's decision to completely cancel TC got him a lot of votes.
Relax, the current streetcars aren't going anywhere and he knows it but he certainly will not be building any new lines which is fine.
In an odd way Toronto may see a rennaisance of transit under his regime as he will be held to account much more than probably any mayor before him. If McGuinty allows him to reallocate his funds then his 2015 plan could definately be done...........piece of cake. It will also mean better bang for the buck as you can be damn sure that tenders will go out to all companies and not just the unionized ones which is one of the reasons infastructure costs are so much higher in Toronto than other cities.
 
They interviewed the chair of metrolinx on CP24.

He very cautiously said " we'll talk with the new mayor" - but that we have a plan, Move Ontario , that is already being built.

Very polite way of telling Ford to stick it, more or less.
He's just protecting his turf, which is to be expected.

I think Metrolinx and the Province have to make a new deal with Ford before the 2011 election. Ford's got some time on his hands. The others don't.
 
Not according to the city's website.. but its strongly worded strictly for the purposes to scare off any cancellations. And as been stated by both Metrolinx and the Province; they already have a plan, and they are sticking to it.
Your smoking something, if you think these projects would continue ... unless Ford actually has half a brain (which would be a quarter more than he's shown any evidence of previously) and realises it is this or nothing. The province has no incentive to push projects that the city would fights - it's political suicide.

As are the subway lovers who think Ford could actually fulfill his election promise about subways. There is neither the funding available, or the timeframe. The environmental assessment alone would take a couple of years.
 
Exclusive of those. 1.44 billion if you include those. 620 mil in design and consulting alone has been spent. That is 12x the TBM cost.
Gone. Ford will surely throw it away ... watching the pennies, and destroying the dollars.
 

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