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Thread: Mayor Rob Ford's Toronto

  1. #6661
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    First, there's absolutely nothing wrong with Ford, as a private citizen, to purchase land from the TRCA. Developers do it all the time, Empire just did with Eau du Soleil. It's a routine procedure. Those homes that back onto the Humber valley where Ford lives are worth well over a million. I wouldn't be surprised if this isn't the first time the TRCA sold land to one of those homeowners.

    Now, I was never really a fan of the Star. Lately they have been sinking into tabloid-territory and their lack of journalistic integrity is beginning to mirror the Sun. This has to take the cake though. The editors and the journalist should have known better than to snoop around Ford's house in the evening. I bet he was secretely hoping he would catch Ford doing something stupid like ranting in a drunk stupor on his porch or beating his wife. Now if anyone says there is nothing suspicious about being on public property behind those houses, let me explain that those ravines are hard to access and hard to navigate. The only people who ever go there are nature enthusiasts and teenagers trying to find some privacy to smoke pot or get drunk. You can bet I would call the cops too if I saw someone with a camera snooping around my backyard; and I'm sure that would go for all of you too.

    Sure, the mayor is a public figure, but when the man is home with his wife and kids that is just wrong.


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    Quote Originally Posted by k10ery View Post
    Oh sorry. I was responding to this idiotic debate going on in the media this week. Ford supporters says "the surplus is big so our guy is doing a good job". The opposition says "the surplus is due to high LTT revenues which Ford wants to cancel".

    Both sides miss the point that the year end surplus happens just because the City can't predict revenues and expenses perfectly at the start of the budget year. It is not a sign of a good job, or a good tax. It is a sign of bad forecasting, period.
    You say bad forecasting - I say reality. Who could forecast that we would have such a mild winter this year for example?

    You can either budget for best case scenario and end up with a deficit every year, or budget for worst case scenario and end up with a surplus. Or somewhere in between. I personally would rather they budget for closer to worst case than best case.

  3. #6663

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eug View Post
    I've been reading the Globe on and off since I was a kid. They've generally pushed the Liberals, but I can most definitely understand why they would have supported Harper last time around.
    They've pushed Harper for years, not just the last election. And it seems bizarre to me, given how extremely right-wing he is.

    Doesn't really matter what the Globe did years ago - things seemed to shift after Bell took control of them. Not sure where things are going to go now that the ownership has changed again. I agree they have historically been centrist; but they haven't shown much of that for near a decade.

    I find the Globe's Toronto coverage quite pathetic actually. They hit some of the biggest issues, but they miss most of the news. Essentially I get the Globe for the national/international news, and the Star for the local. Used to get and enjoy the Post for national/international, but it went from being right-of-centre to bizarrely annoying extremely-right-wing after Black sold the newspaper to Canwest Global. Kind of like the Toronto Sun, but not marketed at people who are illiterate ... it seems to have bounced back a bit more towards normal these days ... however as I think a Globe subscription is in my marriage contract, and the Star is the only local broadsheet, I think I should stop there.

    The Globe often seems to be very late to some major local stories. Not a mention of the Rob Ford stuff from yesterday, even though it went to press well after the story broke. You'd think there would have at least been a bit about his attempt to buy the property - the story that the Star was working on when Rob Ford attacked the reporter. Sigh, I wish we had a decent evening paper ...

    One thing that can be said - the Star seems to be the ONLY paper that actually was researching the property story properly. As much as the wingnuts at the Sun moan about the Star, I guess they can't complain about the Star's journalistic integrity!
    Last edited by nfitz; 2012-May-03 at 10:09.

  4. #6664
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    Quote Originally Posted by nfitz View Post
    They've pushed Harper for years, not just the last election. And it seems bizarre to me, given how extremely right-wing he is.
    Harper has softened considerably since his western Canada days. He's still quite right wing of course, but it's no surprise that the Globe would support him. The federal Liberals in recent years have basically been completely unelectable. I think the Globe simply reflects the opinion of the greater public in many ways, as the combination of Stephane Dion and Michael Ignatieff essentially destroyed the Liberals. It will be interesting to see what Rae can do. Rae is my favourite of all the leaders, but he carries significant baggage from his leadership of the Ontario NDP.

    Sorry to the others we're straying off topic, but I'll just conclude to say that the Star is quite a bit left leaning as compared to the Globe in my opinion, and it almost feels that ever since Ford has been in the limelight, the Star has gone out of its way to talk about him negatively. It makes the Star seem tabloidish. I never read the Sun because they are a tabloid, but I've started to read the Star less and less because they're starting to emulate the Sun but at the other end of the political spectrum. Heck, I may as well just read Now instead.

  5. #6665
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    Quote Originally Posted by gabe View Post
    Rob's story http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/02...ed-trespassing

    "I ran around and I caught him," Ford said. "He just went nuts, he dropped his cellphone, he dropped his tape recorder."

    "I said, 'What are you doing here?' He started screaming, 'Help! Help! ...Help! Help! Help!' I think he thought he was going to die but I didn't touch him.

    "I'm not going to tolerate people taking pictures of my kids and my family in my backyard."

    Daniel Dale's story

    I arrived sometime after 7:30 p.m. I walked around the parkland toward the mayor’s property. I took note of the trees, then, standing perhaps 10 metres from his wooden backyard fence, emailed an additional two sentences to my editor at 7:47. My phone died as I tried to snap photos of the trees and the fencing. I’m still not sure if the parcel I was standing on is the parcel Ford is looking to acquire, but I can say this with certainty: I never came close to entering his backyard.

    Moments after my phone died, the mayor appeared, wearing a white campaign t-shirt, at the sole entrance and exit to the parcel of property; he had walked around from the front of his house. He appeared extremely agitated.

    “Hey buddy,” he yelled. “What are you doing? Are you spying on me? Are you spying on me? Are you spying on me?”

    I shouted, astonished, that I was not – that I was writing about his attempt to buy TRCA land. He began to approach me at a brisk walk, asking again, at an escalating volume, if I was spying. I continued to plead that I was writing about the land.

    At some point, perhaps 10 or 15 seconds into the encounter, he cocked his fist near his head and began charging at me at a full run. I began pleading with him, as loud as I could, with my hands up, for him to stop. I yelled, at the top of my lungs, something like, “Mayor Ford, I’m writing about the land! I’m just looking at the land! You’re trying to buy the TRCA land!” Instinctually, I also reached into my pocket to grab my dead phone. I then fiddled with my voice recorder, trying fruitlessly to turn it on so that I would have a recording of any physical violence.

    At some point, perhaps two metres away from me, the mayor did stop moving toward me, but his face remained menacing, and he continued to cock his fist and shake it. “Drop your phone!” he demanded, shouting louder than I have ever heard him. “Drop your phone! Drop your phone now!”

    Every time I tried to sidestep him to escape, he moved with me and yelled at me again to drop my phone. I became more frightened than I can remember; after two or three attempts to dart away, I threw my phone and my recorder down on the grass, yelled that he could take them, and ran.

    http://www.thestar.com/news/article/...or-s-home?bn=1
    Would you clench your fists and scream at your neighbour when they take pictures of your backyard? Now, what if your neighbour was a park?

    I would hate to have Rob Ford as my neighbour, especially with his temper.
    W. K. Lis

  6. #6666

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    Quote Originally Posted by Filip View Post
    First, there's absolutely nothing wrong with Ford, as a private citizen, to purchase land from the TRCA. Developers do it all the time, Empire just did with Eau du Soleil. It's a routine procedure. Those homes that back onto the Humber valley where Ford lives are worth well over a million. I wouldn't be surprised if this isn't the first time the TRCA sold land to one of those homeowners.
    In that case, they sold an unconnected roadside TRCA parcel to facilitate a major development. In this case, they are being asked to sell parkland to make it into the backyard of a private home. This is not common.

    Here's what it looks like: the bunch of trees between the Ford home and the community centre. Even if Ford could have got this done quietly - say with a conservation easement to prevent future buildings - I think he has eliminated that chance through his petty little temper tantrum.

    http://binged.it/JW6kSY

  7. #6667

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    Quote Originally Posted by k10ery View Post
    In that case, they sold an unconnected roadside TRCA parcel to facilitate a major development. In this case, they are being asked to sell parkland to make it into the backyard of a private home. This is not common.

    Here's what it looks like: the bunch of trees between the Ford home and the community centre. Even if Ford could have got this done quietly - say with a conservation easement to prevent future buildings - I think he has eliminated that chance through his petty little temper tantrum.

    http://binged.it/JW6kSY
    In any case, why is it not possible for Ford to build the fence over his own property? How much space does a fence take?

    Looking at the diagrams in the Star, the parcel of land he's looking to buy far exceeds the requirement for a security fence.

  8. #6668
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    I used to enjoy the Star more before it decided that Ford could do no right. Now, I'm not a Ford supporter at all. But it's not really about Ford here - it's that the Star has grossly biased their journalism and made it more tabloid-like. Ford is doing plenty wrong that we could use well-written and well-reasoned articles about. We don't need KFC videos and junky events like this latest one. This is Toronto Sun-level garbage.

    I worry that the Star's relentlessly negative coverage might start to have a reverse effect - and make people start sympathizing with Ford. No one would like a major paper unfairly going after them, and my feeling is that people are more on Ford's side about this latest little incident than not.

    I'm glad that there is a paper that sees Ford for the incoherent problem that he is for the city. But we need and deserve a better written one. The Star needs to get smart and clean up it's act quickly if it wants to be above reproach, and have any far-reaching influence.

  9. #6669

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    Quote Originally Posted by k10ery View Post
    "Ford’s surplus comes almost entirely on the back of the Land Transfer Tax. Though Ford has vowed to get rid of it, it’s hard to find fault with a revenue tool that has continuously outperformed staff estimates. "

    http://metronews.ca/voices/ford-for-...unprecedented/
    Exaggeration of almost TorontoSun proportion. The Land Transfer Tax share was $98mn, which is a third of $292 mn surplus. Also, "The city saved $80 million from a hiring slowdown" (from InsideToronto)

  10. #6670
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    The article from the reporter is too much!

    "My phone died as I tried to snap photos of the trees and the fencing."
    - A journalist goes out to investigate with a phone on low battery? Yup.. Ok

    " then fiddled with my voice recorder, trying fruitlessly to turn it on so that I would have a recording of any physical violence."
    -How.. convenient?

    "I became more frightened than I can remember; after two or three attempts to dart away, I threw my phone and my recorder down on the grass, yelled that he could take them, and ran."
    -Was he reporting from a quiet Etobicoke neighbourhood or Kandahar? Nobody could be such a whimp, hell, Ford couldn't run after an ice cream truck let alone this reporter.

    This is the most sensationalist, victim-driven fabricated piece of poor journalism I have ever witnessed. The Star truly hit a new low. This should boost Ford's numbers though.

    Oh and to reply above, Ford has every right to submit A REQUEST to buy TRCA land at market value if he so wishes. This request can either be approved, and Ford can purchase it at MARKET value, or it can be denied, so too bad for the mayor. He did this as a private citizen and not the mayor. Also, this is not traditional parkland. It's mulch with trees and the park is quite a bit away. There are no paths - it's basically wilderness. There is no wrongdoing or corruption happening. Nothing to investigate, Toronto Star, move along now.
    Last edited by Filip; 2012-May-03 at 12:17.

  11. #6671
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianNational View Post
    I used to enjoy the Star more before it decided that Ford could do no right. Now, I'm not a Ford supporter at all. But it's not really about Ford here - it's that the Star has grossly biased their journalism and made it more tabloid-like. Ford is doing plenty wrong that we could use well-written and well-reasoned articles about. We don't need KFC videos and junky events like this latest one. This is Toronto Sun-level garbage.

    I worry that the Star's relentlessly negative coverage might start to have a reverse effect - and make people start sympathizing with Ford. No one would like a major paper unfairly going after them, and my feeling is that people are more on Ford's side about this latest little incident than not.

    I'm glad that there is a paper that sees Ford for the incoherent problem that he is for the city. But we need and deserve a better written one. The Star needs to get smart and clean up it's act quickly if it wants to be above reproach, and have any far-reaching influence.
    I couldn't agree more, well said.
    The backyard story was newsworthy, but the writer was just asking for it by sneaking around snapping photos of Ford's property as darkness approached.
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  12. #6672

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eug View Post
    ... as the combination of Stephane Dion and Michael Ignatieff essentially destroyed the Liberals.
    I think your correct on this (and the Globe too perhaps). But I think you have to add Paul Martin to this list as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eug View Post
    Sorry to the others we're straying off topic, but I'll just conclude to say that the Star is quite a bit left leaning as compared to the Globe in my opinion, and it almost feels that ever since Ford has been in the limelight, the Star has gone out of its way to talk about him negatively.
    Certainly further left ... but the Star seemed to go out of it's way to talk about Miller negatively. Some of the stuff they published back then, seemed almost as odd (perhaps even more so, as it seemed so out-of-place). In many ways, the Star contributed hugely to Ford being elected, as they set Miller up as the Bogeyman, that let Ford come in and slay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nfitz View Post
    They've pushed Harper for years, not just the last election.
    Not in response to you, but in case anyone is interested - the Globe and Mail's federal endorsement record is as follows: Liberals: 8, Conservatives: 16, no-one: 2. Since 1970 it's been 4:9 Lib:PC. Federally, their leanings are clear. Provincially, it's closer to 50:50.

    I would agree with Eug's sentiments about the Star's recent leanings, although I find them pretty inconsistent when viewed over time. They tacked somewhat left against Lastman but never really opposed him the way they do Ford; played the field during the Miller election until it became clear Miller was the frontrunner; hung out in the centre-left for five years; and then tacked right to tar Miller in and around the same time that it became known (in the backrooms) that Smitherman was going to run. Since that backfired, they've swerved left again.

    I do think they've gone a bit far on the Ford-baiting. I also have to admit Ford engages in Star-baiting. Neither is appropriate.

    The Globe's outlook is much much less partisan, and more politically consistent (but of course not without bias or purpose.) To give the Star some credit, they have their Atkinson principles which makes thier political stance a bit more transparent than that of other papers.

    Re: the might as well read Now comment, good point - it is also interesting to see the Star's parent company re-brand their old freebie to better compete with Now.
    Last edited by jeff316; 2012-May-03 at 14:09.

  14. #6674
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeff316 View Post
    I do think they've gone a bit far on the Ford-baiting. I also have to admit Ford engages in Star-baiting. Neither is appropriate.
    Agreed, but personally, I blame Ford more than the Star. It's part of any big-city mayor's job to deal with the media, even those media that do not share their views. Ford needs to deal with it instead of being a jerk and blowing his top, or he needs to not be the mayor. If I didn't do part of my job and kept screaming and yelling at people, I'd be fired.

    But, and it pains me to admit, this whole thing has me agreeing with Matt Gurney in the NatPost (who, IMHO, is a both a bit of a lightweight and a populist of the Sun mould). Give the Mayor a police detail. And then tell him to shut up already and let an adult do the talking for him in high stress situations.

  15. #6675

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eug View Post
    Heh, of course people here would people say that.

    Most people I talk to say that the Globe leans centre-left or centrist on most things, although for pure financial policy sometimes it may be centrist or centre-right. IOW, it has a reputation of being socially liberal and fiscally conservative.
    That's dishonest. The G&M and its editorial board and columnists (Ibbitson, Wente, et al) have been glossing over and downplaying much of the misdoings of the Harper Government (tm) for the past year. Marcus Gee has been doing much the same for Ford since he was elected. Where's Mr. Barber when you need him?

    The National Post has been more balanced and honest in its coverage of day-to-day politics than the G&M has been in recent history. Who could have predicted that?

    Quote Originally Posted by dt_toronto_geek View Post
    I couldn't agree more, well said.
    The backyard story was newsworthy, but the writer was just asking for it by sneaking around snapping photos of Ford's property as darkness approached.
    That's if you believe Ford's account. When Xena approached him, he said it was dark and it was frightening his daughter, but when the video was released, it had the audacity to contradict his account.

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