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View Poll Results: Was 9/11 an inside job?

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  • Yes

    46 33.58%
  • No

    91 66.42%
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Thread: September 11th: Real or Fraud?

  1. Default

    Well atleast you can admit to me catching you contradicting yourself.. I don't see how it helps your case though lol.

    You want government released evidence. The 9/11 commission report isn't evidence but to you it is because our government released it and said it was, right? Unless our own establishment releases something and calls it evidence that means it's evidence to you. Which is why I'll say this again:

    Seriously, have a mind, think for yourself, don't let others think for you. Have a heart, don't be judgmental, don't be stuck up, it's not worth it in the long run! people will connect with you better if you open up instead of being uptight and narrow minded.

    You guys probably sit in front of the propaganda machine every morning instead of looking for alternative news sources.. So when someone like me comes a long to discuss a controversial topic it's gotten to the point where you can't even have a discussion anymore and you go right into a stage of denial and attack "No! it can't be possible! no! I was told differently! go away! I refuse to discuss it!"

    You guys are only showing to me that you are completely lead by the government media/propaganda. And i love how you guys are always accusing me of being narrow-minded when you can't even define what open-mindedness is and ugh keep trying guys.

    Here's another question: Why are all our personal freedoms being taken away from us? Something that our for fathers warned us about?

    So go ahead keep believing everything the propaganda machine tells you... Believe that Osama was killed on May 1st after he had been reported dead almost 10 years ago then reported dead another times years later by other sources that are more reliable than our government.

    EDIT: In the end, all I can do is help wake people up to the truth. And I'm never asking you to take my word for it. All I'm asking is that you be open-minded and do your own research before buying into the governments/corporations propaganda.

    Please watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5KyWxU-bkg

    He's pretty much the one of very few politicians who isn't a sociopath. Unfortunately sociopathic politicians depend on weak minded people who will buy their propaganda


  2. #602

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    You want government released evidence. The 9/11 commission report isn't evidence but to you it is because our government released it and said it was, right? Unless our own establishment releases something and calls it evidence that means it's evidence to you. Which is why I'll say this again:
    As I indicated the last few times you posted this exact passage, I'm challenging you to produce verifiable, corroborating evidence to support your conspiracy claims. That does not necessarily mean evidence originating from the government. You keep bringing the 9/11 Commission Report up - even though you have admitted never reading it. Exactly how open-minded are you when you doubt a report you have not read?

    Kamuix, the rest of your post is a cut and pasting of some of your previous posts - all of which have been answered with a challenge to you to show the necessary supporting evidence of your conspiracy claims. Either do that, or finally admit you have no evidence and possess only an uninformed opinion that has no actual supporting factual evidence.

  3. Default

    Yes but if a report comes out and the government attacks it and say's it's not evidence, than to you it's not evidence while the 9/11 commission report is to you, correct? I asked you many times if you considered it evidence and you wouldn't answer the simply question a long with many others so I'll say again:

    You want government released evidence. The 9/11 commission report isn't evidence it's just a US government theory but to you it is because our government released it and said it was, right? Unless our own establishment releases something and calls it evidence that means it's evidence to you.

  4. #604

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    Yes but if a report comes out and the government attacks it and say's it's not evidence, than to you it's not evidence while the 9/11 commission report is to you, correct? I asked you many times if you considered it evidence and you wouldn't answer the simply question a long with many others so I'll say again:
    You are asking a question and not citing any specific report. To what report are you referring to? Please provide the publication information. And remember Kamuix, conspiracy "documentaries" found on the web that merely go in circles among conspiracy-believers like you are not verifiable evidence, but presentation that lack sourcing and authentification.

    As I have mentioned to you before, I have not read the 9/11 Commission Report. As it is YOU who is impugning this document, the burden is on you to read it and cite exactly why you think it lacks validity. Once again, this would necessitate that you present verifiable evidence that would counter the observations or conclusions found in that report.

    You have completely failed to to any of this Kamuix.

    Regarding the rest of your cut and paste posting, I'll remind you yet again that you are being challenged to provide verifiable corroborating evidence that supports your claims of a government conspiracy regarding the events of 9/11. To repeat: you are making a claim of an existing conspiracy. You have referenced "truth" in many of your postings. You state that there is a conspiracy. Your stance absolutely demands that you provide evidence that can be examined, verified or falsified in order to conclude the accuracy of your assertion.

    You are unable to produce such evidence. You have no such evidence and won't admit it here. You do not even understand what verifiable evidence is. You confuse your groundless beliefs as being equal or superior to actual verifiable evidence. You presume knowledge you do not possess and accuse others of being brainwashed or closed-minded because they do not accept your unsupported accusations. Finally, you either refuse to accept, or are intellectually incapable of comprehending that all you possess on this matter is an unjustified suspicion. In other words, all you have is mere unsubstantiated opinion, and you are simply too afraid to admit that this is all you have.

  5. Default

    Yes but if a report comes out and the government attacks it and say's it's not evidence, than to you it's not evidence while the 9/11 commission report is to you, correct? I asked you many times if you considered it evidence and you wouldn't answer the simply question a long with many others so I'll say again:

    You want government released evidence. The 9/11 commission report isn't evidence it's just a US government theory but to you it is because our government released it and said it was, right? Unless our own establishment releases something and calls it evidence that means it's evidence to you.

    Ahh see you avoided the underlined question once again just like I said you would

  6. #606

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    Yes but if a report comes out and the government attacks it and say's it's not evidence, than to you it's not evidence while the 9/11 commission report is to you, correct? I asked you many times if you considered it evidence and you wouldn't answer the simply question a long with many others...[/B][/U]
    Because your capacity to retain information is questionable, I'll repeat what I have stated before in earlier posts (so read it slowly): I have not read the 9/11 Commission Report.

    Here is the second and more important part: you have not read the report either, but you are convinced that the content is fraudulent. In order to prove that view, you must show evidence to support your assertion of a conspiracy and cover-up. You have failed to do this over and over again.

    Kamuix, you are making the conspiracy claim, so the burden of proof is on you. Stop trying to dodge this very simple fact. Start producing verifiable evidence.

  7. Default

    Yes but if a report comes out and the government attacks it and say's it's not evidence, than to you it's not evidence while the 9/11 commission report is to you, correct? I asked you many times if you considered it evidence and you wouldn't answer the simply question a long with many others...

    And again you ignore the question and many others, you refuse to discuss the topic because it's obvious that you're afraid of where it could lead.

    Important Points:

    I'm trying to get people to look outside the box and consider what i have to say and have shown.
    I'm not offering what i say as absolute proof.
    You won't offer proof for the side you're defending.
    You keep making the same stupid argument over and over.
    You don't address important things that I ask.
    You've made up your own rule that because I made a claim I must show absolute evidence and you won't discuss anything.

    Also remember a pages ago when you we're fucked up enough to accuse me of not answering your questions when at the exact same time you were avoiding answering one of my questions that I clearly asked you to answer?

    Look at this guys:

    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    Oh.. but there's another question you have to answer and that is, why is that just because i haven't shown what you call proof it's not allowed to be discussed? See i support discussing it but you obviously think it shouldn't be discussed unless your type of proof is shown, why is that?

    Watch guys.. he won't address or answer the question.
    His response after avoiding the question:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gristle View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    Watch guys.. he won't address or answer the question.
    This is so you Kamuix.
    See.. now later on he did put my question is quotes as to pretend to address it, but look closely:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gristle View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    why is that just because i haven't shown what you call proof you won't discuss it?
    Because verifiable evidence is absolutely necessary in order to prove your accusations of government complicity in the events of 9/11. The burden of proof is on you to support your claims. If you don't have verifiable evidence, admit it and state that all you are expressing is your mere opinion, and nothing more.

    That's all terribly difficult for you to understand.
    My response:

    Here's a good example, actually this is even more fucked up because you answer my question by saying "Because verifiable evidence is absolutely necessary in order to prove your accusations of government complicity in the events of 9/11." You created the illusion that you answered the question, but I asked you why you're not even willing to discuss it not why i have to show what you call evidence. It's so fucked because you quote me on everything as to discuss it, but you don't even address it properly you just got back to saying the same narrow minded thing.

    But you don't need me to explain it.. just look at it with some depth it takes next to no brain power just less narrow mindedness nonsense.

    This is just once example of how much he can manipulate things possibly without people picking up on it..

    If you're too narrow minded to discuss the topic than how can you be so confident in what you believe? Why are we the people loosing our freedoms Grissie? Why are living costs going up? Do you really want to just sit there and believe everything the TV tells you without question then accuse people like me of being crazy?

    You want government released evidence. The 9/11 commission report isn't evidence it's just a US government theory but to you it is because our government released it and said it was, right? Unless our own establishment releases something and calls it evidence that means it's evidence to you. As proof that this is true I asked you if the 9.11 commission report was evidence to you and you dodged the question
    Last edited by Kamuix; 2011-Jun-19 at 09:45.

  8. #608

    Default

    I'm trying to get people to look outside the box and consider what i have to say and have shown.
    OK fine, but why oh why, can you not accept that people HAVE looked outside the box, HAVE considered points of view other than that presented in mainstream media and have found what you have to say to be less than convincing? You, in your narrow-minded world, think that people are wrong if they don't agree with you. You cannot accept that people can look at a number of theories/ideas/whatever and come to a different conclusion than you did. You like to call others narrow-minded, but you, Kamuix, are the most narrow-minded of all because you cannot accept that other people are intelligent and can evaluate what they see in YouTubes or on websites and come to their own conclusions which differ from yours.

    That does not mean that people are brainwashed. It means they have functioning brains that have evaluated what they have been presented with and have decided what is credible and what isn't.

  9. Default

    Because you haven't you only think you have because you're afraid to discuss something that's controversial and you make it obvious.

  10. #610

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    I'm not afraid to discuss anything. However, in order to discuss one needs to do more than continuously cut and paste the same content over and over again. I don't think I have considered the options, I know I have. I've read and watched what you posted, and nothing has convinced me. You've presented some coincidences (ooh, 3 people were away from their desks at the same time) and some theories, but you haven't presented a single fact.

  11. Default

    Simply not true, i've presented way more then that, you just seem to be trying to convince yourself that anything controversial cannot possibly be true because it's not majority opinion therefore we must of all looked into it or something... and whenever we did get talking about something you would always run away from the conversation and come back later.

    Seriously guys, I know I seemed a little angry but I was like you guys just a few years back and throughout elementary school and high school I believed everything they told me, I believed that we were attacked by terrorists on 9/11 and I thought that the only way to be successful was to go to college but honestly their are soo many lies that we're being taught in school it's unbelievable.

    I know it's hard to accept when you first look into this stuff because honestly no one wants to believe that these big corporations have been lying to us for political gain but honestly it's because of denial that we're still in this situation. Honestly I've been in your shoes and I went though the whole denial stage for a bit a couple years back but trust me you'll thank yourself when you wake up to the truth.

    Honestly here are the best documentaries:

    Loose change, pretty much goes through all the evidence on staged 9/11 attack and trust me you have to actually sit back and watch the whole thing with an open mind to really see the reality of it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28QukKjwLtI

    The Obama deception which explains how big corporations paid for obamas campaign which is one of the most deceiving things in history: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw

    The college conspiracy which explains how we're pretty much brainwashed through school that in order to be successful you have to go to college: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpZtX32sKVE

    How weed won the west which explains the fraudulent war on drugs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YHZco3bKT0

    Here's another thing to consider not that I think your narrow minds have the ability to be open minded: In history and currently most countries governments and politics propagandize their people to think what they want them to think.

    Oh, and I have another question for the brainwashed: Why is that when Obama got into office, he went back on all his promises of change like bring the troops home, lower taxes, take away the corrupt regulations that kill small businesses and benefit big corporations, get rid of corrupt laws etc.. And continued the EXACT agenda that bush bush had? He sent more troops, added more wars, put in more regulations, raised taxes, added more corrupt laws, helped out his rich friends on wall-street etc..

    Oh! but we're in Canada! Oh wait a minute.. we voted Stephen Harper back in who was giving big corporations tax breaks, adding regulations and doing other things that we're sending productive producers away from our counter.. Still don't get it? Our governments are owned by the same big corporations! Don't you ever wonder why even though presidents/PMs change up that things never seem to really change for the better? Other than technology, everything has been getting worse?

    See this is what I mean, until you guys learn how to get past the fake reality that all the propaganda and media etc. lead you to believe, you'll never be able to get a grip on reality and you'll be stuck in this narrow-minded way of thinking. I'm sorry that 9/11 was staged but the quicker people wake up to the truth the quicker we can get rid of the power structure and the politicians who are responsible for this.

    It makes it kind of hard for me to take the arguments seriously because even though you guys seem to be smart people, at some point you've become over-confident in yourselves when it comes to learning important things and expanding your minds. Don't get me wrong you're all smart, but it's not all about things like being smart or having a lot of money. You guys have given into a lot of corruption that has affected society is really bad ways and is only getting worse.

    Here's another question: Why are all our personal freedoms being taken away from us? Something that our for fathers warned us about?

  12. #612

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    Why does anyone keep arguing with someone who is clearly so mentally unbalanced? What's the point?

  13. #613

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    Yes but if a report comes out and the government attacks it and say's it's not evidence, than to you it's not evidence while the 9/11 commission report is to you, correct?
    First, to what report are you making reference to? Second, you are the individual who is asserting that there is a government conspiracy behind the events of 9/11. That means it is up to you to provide verifiable evidence that can falsify any of the existing conclusions found in documents such as 9/11 Commission Report. With that noted, it is then a necessary requirement that you first actually read this report - something you have admitted to never doing - and then be able to provide the necessary corroborating proof in order to bring its summary and conclusions into question.

    As noted over and over Kamuix, you are the person making the accusation of a conspiracy. The burden of proof is yours. I am asking you to provide that evidence, or admit here that you have none and are only operating an unsubstantiated opinion.

    So, in the absence of being able to provide anything remotely substantial in the way of evidence Kamuix, let's check the wiggle-effort that you resort to in trying to avoid admitting that all you have to offer is your groundless suspicions

    I'm trying to get people to look outside the box and consider what i have to say and have shown.
    I'm not offering what i say as absolute proof.
    You won't offer proof for the side you're defending.
    You keep making the same stupid argument over and over.
    You don't address important things that I ask.
    You've made up your own rule that because I made a claim I must show absolute evidence and you won't discuss anything.
    First, you admit you have no proof (see above). That simply underscores what has been plainly obvious in this thread: you have no evidence that could be described as remotely substantial when asserting a conspiracy claim. That inevitably means that you have no grounds whatsoever to claim that there is, or ever has been, a government conspiracy. The only conclusion is that you are endlessly airing a paranoid opinion and have no idea what evidence is actually necessary.

    Second, you are quite obviously fully engaged in a very narrow-minded position when it comes to your belief in the existence of a government conspiracy. You have no evidence, but hold doggedly to this conspiracy belief. In the absence of any necessary supporting facts or evidence, you refuse to admit that you could be wrong. You have never done that Kamuix. That makes you look very narrow-minded.

    Third, I'm not, nor have I ever been defending, a "side." Your remarks make it clear that you have paid very little attention to the thread, or can't quite comprehend what is being communicated to you. What I am challenging you to do is to provide actual, verifiable evidence to support your claim that there is a government conspiracy regarding the events of 9/11. At the very least, that would necessarily require a clear set of details regarding timelines, key players, rationales, methods, etc., and all the necessary documents that would support these items. All I have been doing here is demanding that you support your claim. You have none of this Kamuix. You have a mere unfounded suspicion. You have admitted to having no evidence.

    Fourth, if you don't like my repeated questions then why don't you finally admit that your suspicion is without any rational support, you have no evidence, and you merely hold an unsubstantiated opinion that you simply can't back up with corroborating evidence.

    Fifth, regarding the addressing of important things, you have not raised anything important.

    Sixth, I am challenging you to provide the necessary verifiable evidence that supports your conspiracy claims because that is the method by which conspiracies are shown to exist. What you seem to want is for people to believe every word you say. Others are not as gullible as you. Moreover, it is you who is confused or is lacking the knowledge to know what the necessary evidence is. Your conspiracy claims have been nothing but vague and nebulous and without even the most remote semblance of a descriptive outline. You actually possess nothing of substance, Kamuix. Zero.

    Here's a good example, actually this is even more fucked up because you answer my question by saying "Because verifiable evidence is absolutely necessary in order to prove your accusations of government complicity in the events of 9/11." You created the illusion that you answered the question, but I asked you why you're not even willing to discuss it not why i have to show what you call evidence. It's so fucked because you quote me on everything as to discuss it, but you don't even address it properly you just got back to saying the same narrow minded thing.
    There is nothing "fucked up" about it Kamuix. Providing proof is necessary in fields ranging from science to law. Providing sound reasoning is necessary for rational discourse. You have failed at his completely Kamuix. You have offered no reasoning, no evidence and no theory regarding your claims of a conspiracy. When making conspiracy accusations, these things become your responsibility. Other people then have a right to question your claims. The burden of proof is always on you.

    But you don't need me to explain it.. just look at it with some depth it takes next to no brain power just less narrow mindedness nonsense.
    Actually Kamuix, the entire thread is a testament that illustrates you hold to an opinion that is unsupported by facts, that you do not comprehend what verifiable evidence is, and that when challenged to lay out your argument, you resort to sad diversions in an attempt to take the attention off the fact that all you possess is a paranoid opinion and nothing more.
    Last edited by gristle; 2011-Jun-20 at 00:31.

  14. Default

    Yea but proof is a strong word and proof to you is whatever the media/government tell us so here we go:

    I'm trying to get people to look outside the box and consider what i have to say and have shown.
    I'm not offering what i say as absolute proof.
    You won't offer proof for the side you're defending.
    You keep making the same stupid argument over and over.
    You don't address important things that I ask.
    You've made up your own rule that because I made a claim I must show absolute evidence and you won't discuss anything.

    If you're too narrow minded to discuss the topic than how can you be so confident in what you believe? Why are we the people loosing our freedoms Grissie? Why are living costs going up? Do you really want to just sit there and believe everything the TV tells you without question then accuse people like me of being crazy?

    You want government released evidence. The 9/11 commission report isn't evidence it's just a US government theory but to you it is because our government released it and said it was, right? Unless our own establishment releases something and calls it evidence that means it's evidence to you. As proof that this is true I asked you if the 9.11 commission report was evidence to you and you dodged the question


    1. You automatically believe them without question why? The establishment has never lied to you?

    2. That's a bit of a generalization to base your beliefs off of isn't it? Governments are powerful and can pay off or make anyone look like professionals. Why not look at the other side of the story with an open mind first? you're going off what we've all been told from the beginning.

    3. Terrorists that work or have worked for the CIA who are not supposed to be operational inside the USA yet are? Have you taken a glance at the credibility of who you're believing? Put aside the fact that it's our controllers first.

    4. How is this is any form true? They have every reason to do it, you know how tyrannical governments work with brainwashing. How else could they convince the country that they need to take our freedoms away to protect us? Raise taxes?

    5. Tons of people that were at the world trade center when it happened have come forward about things they witnessed that were denied to have happened and these people were also excluded from the 9/11 report. What is hard evidence to you anyway? How brainwashed can you get..

    6. Again they're are tons of things to gain of the globalists to commit these crimes, especially in what it is they want to do like create a world government and world constitutions, raise taxes, destroy the middle class etc.. It's tyranny. It's happened in history too many times to think people this bad and this evil don't exist. In your mind bad and evil may just be a rapist or a pedafile. but even they are dwarfed my politicians. you don't think you know how bad and corrupt these people can get.

    Why does anyone keep arguing with someone who is clearly so mentally unbalanced? What's the point?
    And you obviously know nothing on the subject so... what's the point of posting this?

    Just open your mind to the possibility everything you're feeding me is what the government has been feeding us. But why so much trust in the government? Governments need to be held to what they should be doing. In a conditioned society people are just to brainwashed to see this..

    I'm sorry but you have to take a look at the other side of the story.. And i don't mean reading a few things and in your head not being able to wait to demolish they're arguments because sub-consciously you don't want to give it a chance.

    I also think you may underestimate the power of your sub-conscious mind. Please just think for a moment about it.. You can't just believe everything the establishment says without question especially in a society and economy that's falling as much as ours is


    Honestly here are the best documentaries:

    Loose change, pretty much goes through all the evidence on staged 9/11 attack and trust me you have to actually sit back and watch the whole thing with an open mind to really see the reality of it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28QukKjwLtI

    The Obama deception which explains how big corporations paid for obamas campaign which is one of the most deceiving things in history: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw

    The college conspiracy which explains how we're pretty much brainwashed through school that in order to be successful you have to go to college: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpZtX32sKVE

    How weed won the west which explains the fraudulent war on drugs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YHZco3bKT0
    Last edited by Kamuix; 2011-Jun-20 at 01:12.

  15. #615

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kamuix View Post
    Loose change, pretty much goes through all the evidence on staged 9/11 attack and trust me you have to actually sit back and watch the whole thing with an open mind to really see the reality of it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28QukKjwLtI
    Watched some of it ... doesn't say much. Unnecessarily drawn out. It uses quote after quote completely out of context.

    Anyone who believe one second of something like this is either mentally-disturbed or intellectually-challenged and naive, and should be segregated from society for their safety or ours.

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